tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post7334321583287219933..comments2024-03-27T07:41:27.083-07:00Comments on Great Ming Military: Some random mythbustings — Wokou Edition春秋戰國http://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-27813682446571934082023-01-15T09:37:54.493-08:002023-01-15T09:37:54.493-08:00What are some documents were I can see this phenom...What are some documents were I can see this phenomenon? Like a decree notifying the arrival of Japanese emissaries?wakawakwakahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15264808613704582683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-23636324137343547562023-01-15T04:56:30.431-08:002023-01-15T04:56:30.431-08:00@WAKAWAKWAKA
No, often the translated names only r...@WAKAWAKWAKA<br />No, often the translated names only resemble Japanese in the vaguest sense.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-23820034572395585122023-01-11T20:19:58.275-08:002023-01-11T20:19:58.275-08:00I know that Koreans used to translate Japanese nam...I know that Koreans used to translate Japanese names like Chinese people, but no longer do it. I am curious how far back does the Chinese way of translating Japanese go.wakawakwakahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15264808613704582683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-56788555921590920502023-01-11T20:19:02.748-08:002023-01-11T20:19:02.748-08:00Would the names of Japanese people be translated l...Would the names of Japanese people be translated like they are today in Chinese though in proper speech though? Like Takeda Shingen being called Wutian Shinxuan by Ming era Chinese?wakawakwakahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15264808613704582683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-91816603696884401662022-12-26T18:27:55.186-08:002022-12-26T18:27:55.186-08:00@ANon
I am currently updating my blog posts about ...@ANon<br />I am currently updating my blog posts about Wokou. Once it's done, you can read about them there.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-59937628613711152082022-12-25T18:18:47.563-08:002022-12-25T18:18:47.563-08:00Thank you for the detailed informative response, b...Thank you for the detailed informative response, btw I also read on Zhihu (https://zhuanlan.zhihu.com/p/513944281) that there was a clear distinction between Chinese pirates and the Wokou (Japanese pirates and Chinese pirates that colluded with the Japanese). Is this information true? Also, how common was it for Chinese pirate lords to hire Ex-Japanese warriors? Thank you so muchANonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13695543350411963275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-56032100624115321322022-12-19T17:07:40.059-08:002022-12-19T17:07:40.059-08:00That's because Chinese at the time barely knew...That's because Chinese at the time barely knew any Japanese (language), so they had a really hard time recording Japanese names. Most of the time they were being called with nicknames (for example "雙劍潭", which literally means "Double-sword pond"), or some kind of transliterated pseudo-Japanese such as "乌鲁羙他郎" which is unintelligible to actual Japanese speaker.<br /><br />We know that a tribute mission sent by Otomo Yoshishige directly joined the Wokou after it was met with hostility though.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-8084717989893254312022-12-18T22:32:01.953-08:002022-12-18T22:32:01.953-08:00Hi I'm a big fan of your work and I'd appr...Hi I'm a big fan of your work and I'd appreciate it if you could answer this question of mine, were there any significant Japanese Wokou figures/forces that were met in combat by the Ming military? Because you always hear about those climatic naval battles between the Ming navy and Chinese pirates but you almost never hear of a Japanese name going against the Ming. Thank youANonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13695543350411963275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-47505502235754073552020-04-19T05:36:24.788-07:002020-04-19T05:36:24.788-07:00@Someone who's Bored
Good day and welcome to m...@Someone who's Bored<br />Good day and welcome to my blog.<br /><br />Your first point is fair. I shall revise my article to remove the "peasants" part.<br /><br />As for your second point on self bow, while I have not doubt that humidity played a part, I should note that Japan and southern part of China are also fairly humid, so there might be other factors/considerations.<br />春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-34140481283340475442020-04-19T05:04:15.397-07:002020-04-19T05:04:15.397-07:00I just want to point out that the statements about...I just want to point out that the statements about the English longbow are a little misleading. First off, it wasn't peasants who used the longbow, but specifically the Yeomanry (who would also be the retainers that you mention), who are a type of free landowner, who would fight as both foot archers and as a force of mobile skirmishers on horseback. Secondly, the reason for the use of a selfbow as opposed to the laminated bow common in Asia is all about maintenance and ease of manufacture, northern Europe is very wet and at despite having the technology for laminated bows (which were actually in use in the Meditereanean), they seem to have decided that the increased power was not worth the price of replacing them everytime they succumbed to the moisture in the air.Someone who's Boredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16910364599249340597noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-89379342648984558612020-03-26T07:16:28.312-07:002020-03-26T07:16:28.312-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.henriquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207388042318856546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-85221229047765534892020-03-23T20:39:01.500-07:002020-03-23T20:39:01.500-07:00@henrique
1. I only say he didn't invent it. ...@henrique<br /><br />1. I only say he didn't invent it. Obviously Japanese arquebusiers still mastered the tactic at some point.<br /><br />2. Yes, they eventually did figure out how to produce saltpetre from urine, although by that time matchlock gun had entered Japan for 2~3 decades. I believe the menthod was first pioneered by Hongan-ji Kennyo during his confict with Oda Nobunaga in the 1570s.<br /><br />3. Ming produced more matchlocks (in total number) right from the very beginning. China is just so much larger and produced more variety of other guns, so by ratio it wasn't as high.<br /><br />Ming army that fought the Japanese during Imjin War consisted of mostly cavalry, that skewed the number towards the lower end.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-66771785376857517602020-03-22T04:55:15.487-07:002020-03-22T04:55:15.487-07:001.
"Oda Nobunaga did not actually invent the ...1.<br />"Oda Nobunaga did not actually invent the three step volley fire tactic, nor did he use it in Battle of Nagashino. The myth stem from Edo period historical fictions and romances, and should not be taken as fact."<br /><br />the chinese and koreans mention step volley fire tactic in the imjin war <br /><br />2.<br />"Gunmaking was actually the least of Japan's concern. Japan did not produce saltpetre (a major ingredient of black powder) domestically, and had to rely on Portuguese traders, China (through illicit trade), Siam, India, and Philippines for imports. As high demand drove the price up, they even resorted to slave trading (selling women captured from rival daimyō to the Europeans) in order to cover the expense. Besides, Japan could not produce enough lead to meet the demand of their firearms, so they also had to import lead from Portuguese traders to cast bullets"<br /><br />The kyushu-based clans imported saltpeter due to the shortage of resources. Japan already used artificial european and non-european recipes to obtain salpeter... saltpeter plantations, paddy fields, corpses, niter beds, nearby guano islands, urine, manure, wood ash etc...<br /><br />A recipe for gunpowder, obtained by Otomo Sorin, passed to Ashikaga Yoshiteru, who then sent this letter with the recipe to Uesugi Kenshin:<br />http://komonjo.princeton.edu/uesugi-03/<br /><br />Also:<br />https://edoflourishing.blogspot.com/2020/01/ensho-kaido-saltpeter-road.html?m=1<br /><br />http://bigai.world.coocan.jp/msand/miwa/e_kayafirst.html<br /><br />The wokou played a role much more important than the portuguese in bringing imported saltpeter. Wang Zhi brought Chinese and Siamese saltpeter into Japan amongst other goods, while transporting Japanese sulfur (another ingredient of gunpowder) to Siam. In the process, he became immensely wealthy in hirado. The hojo, takeda and uesugi were better known as gunners than their southern counterparts. <br />Saltpeter and gunpowder were one of the main exports from Japan to the Philippines as they no longer needed them or were just unable to put them in the imjin war, given yi sun-shin's blockade. It is estimated that in 1595 and 1596, when there was a emporary Japanese ceasefire in Korea ,the domestic production of saltpeter exceeded demands and part of the surplus was allocated for export to Luzon. Years later, Pedro Chirino's Relacion de las lslas Filipinas (published in 1604) describes that "from Japan are imported much wheat, and flour, also silver, metals, saltpeter, weapons, and many curiosities."<br /><br />So from the later half of the 1590s Japanese merchants supplied munitions such as saltpeter to the storehouse in Manila almost every year as early as 1591. <br /><br />3."In fact, Japan actually produced much less matchlock guns than Ming China, which had a twenty year head start in matchlock gunmaking, much larger manufacturing base, procured most raw materials domestically, and produced the same gun many times cheaper."<br /><br />But when? Handgonnes were still around as late as the ming-qing transition. By 1600... for sure the matchlock gunmaking production would have stopped in japan. On the other hand... japanese sources mention the ming shortage of guns. henriquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11207388042318856546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-68723082714233893162019-11-24T04:04:13.195-08:002019-11-24T04:04:13.195-08:00https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Toyotomi_h...https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Toyotomi_hideyoshi.jpg<br /><br />https://www.espace4.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Kabuto-kawari-to-kanmuri-cour-chinois-japon-edo-galerie-espace4-expert-art-japonais-924x784.jpg<br /><br />https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B4P9zqCCYAAI7M3.jpg<br /><br />https://sengoku-g.net/blog/2018/01/helmet.html/helmet61_m<br /><br />https://i.redd.it/1gdizxk99cr01.png<br /><br />https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D7s9SLrXkAQvPUB.jpg<br /><br />Japan's Toyotomi Hideyoshi wearing a hat influenced by wushamao and ming-style kabuto, what do you think? wokou influence? Historians believe that neo-Confucianists from china and korea in japan added to their classics collection had a major impact on Japanese neo-Confucianism's early days at this time paeaking in the 16th century before a whole generation following Fujiwara Seika and the Hayashi clan. Yushima Seido wasn't established until 1630 and only after the Kansei Edict (1790), confucianism became Japan's official ideology.<br /><br />http://www.williammaloney.com/Aviation/WestPointMilitaryMuseum/Muzzleloaders/pages/07ChineseMatchlockJapaneseM.htm<br /><br />https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/755608<br /><br />https://chinesemartialstudies.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/mid-19th-century-chinese-soldier-with-matchlock.jpg<br /><br />http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=16881<br /><br />https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/30587<br /><br />sterotypical southern chinese matchlock gun<br /><br />now:<br /><br />pinterest.com/pin/249457266837657732/<br /><br />gun on the far right, obvious southern chinese influence<br /><br /> Chinese artisans had helped design the tiles for Nobunaga’s castles,<br />and Ieyasu and his contemporaries recruited skilled Chinese for their capitals. Some were rewarded with land, samurai titles (河南源兵卫) and residence. English and Dutch visitors who wrote from Japan frequently spoke of the presence of well-rewarded and highly regarded Chinese master artisans. Many of these artisans chose to remain in Japan, changing their names and consequently disappearing from the registers of resident Chinese in result of the sakoku edicts (cultural amnesia) and danka system. In fact the han chinese population boom in japan at the time sounds a lot like taking over of the local urban economy, just the way things have been like to southeast asia in the last 500 years, a minority of "jews" aka bamboo network. For example, despite their small numbers, the Hoa chinese were disproportionately dominant in the Vietnamese economy having started an estimated 70 to 80 per cent of pre-fall of Saigon's privately owned and operated businesses.<br /> Since most of the Chinese who ended up in Japan were of merchant and fishermen roots, this would explain the predominance of Japanese arsenal in the early days. In my observation as the sengoku war was increasingly a total war, every man would have to be recruited into their domain of origin, opening spaces for the wokou commoners of Chinese origin to achieve<br /> higher ranks within the wokou military. It is comparable to the barbarization the roman army, consequently the birth of the pirates of the South China Coast and the sprouts of the future koxinga's army.<br />khanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17992923708375020873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-1612611502169012922019-11-23T21:51:47.757-08:002019-11-23T21:51:47.757-08:00Forcing Chinese captives to dress as Japanese was ...Forcing Chinese captives to dress as Japanese was to prevent them from slipping away unnoticed - a lone outsider (an escapee) with weird hairstyle and dress would be quickily (mis)identified as a Japanese and either killed, chased away or captured by the locals.<br />春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-3096318181862839562019-11-23T20:55:34.692-08:002019-11-23T20:55:34.692-08:00to prevent run away from kanto as well? Sounds lik...to prevent run away from kanto as well? Sounds like a fanciful narration of how barbarian the Japanese were. A well-established practice in China, Chinese families sold their daughters for profit instead of practing female infanticide, the ming officials made up a whole story by saying that Chinese slaves owned by outsiders existed only because they were forcibly taken by foreigners.<br /><br />the Jiajing wokou are the Chinese themselves fully replacing the Japanese's role in bringing Japanese silver to china after selling silk and saltpetre in that archipelago<br />in other words speaking chinese and looking chinese would be easier to smuggle, upon the request of the daimyo who were not able to send their own ships because of the haijin policy. Also the growing need for a mercantilist economy (such as silk, porcelain and etc civil goods..), lead, deerskin (used in japanese armor and sword), and saltpeter to deal with the powder barrel that was sengoku japan.<br /> Mercantilist economy = more trade and urbanization = higher merchant taxes = better funds to invest in war. My guess is Chinese merchants left China dressed as Chinese for Japan and the wokou attacked ming china dressed as armored japanese and even other wokou working for other daimyo patrons. The wokou hierarchy had a whole social stratification<br />was directly sponsored by several kyushu-based clans and all around the seto inland sea, thalassocracy. So probably the wokou who smuggled in chinese ports weren't the same ones who defended and attacked.<br />Anyway, the Chinese fashion at the time was to wear hats for men:<br />https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:上元燈彩圖3.jpg<br /> making easy to hide the Japanese-style haircut for those leaving the Chinese coastal towns for Japan.<br /> After all, ming china was totally on foreign silver (otherwise the first opium war would never have happened), merchants of Chinese origin had been settling in Japan to trade for silver in defiance of the Ming government's prohibition. In addition the economic disorder of the 17th-century china and later ming loyalists taking refuge abroad. This led to the growth of numerous Chinese settlements and neighborhoods known as tojin machi (Chinatowns), found everywhere along the coasts of Kyushu and as far east as Kawagoe and Odawara on the main island of Honshu.khanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17992923708375020873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-49258556182609380482019-11-23T18:26:33.031-08:002019-11-23T18:26:33.031-08:00Some were captured and forced to dress like the Ja...Some were captured and forced to dress like the Japanese (to prevent them from running away), while others wanted to take advantage of the fearsome reputation of Wokou to extort more money out of the scared populace.<br /><br />Instead of "smugglers" that try to keep their heads low, Wokou were closer to Mexican drug cartels that run their operations more-or-less openly.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-25994513075293285202019-11-23T12:17:20.725-08:002019-11-23T12:17:20.725-08:00Since most of them were Chinese who depended on il...Since most of them were Chinese who depended on illegal trade, why would they want to look like Japanese? It's like a smuggler shouting in front of a police station "I'm a smuggler". khanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17992923708375020873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-36859475055478230402018-03-28T19:00:09.320-07:002018-03-28T19:00:09.320-07:00一般上相机的闪光灯会损坏文物,所以除了专家以外最好还是不要拍...
我没有开中文的博客。同时写两边...一般上相机的闪光灯会损坏文物,所以除了专家以外最好还是不要拍...<br /><br />我没有开中文的博客。同时写两边的话兼顾不来,而且那边比我强的牛人多着去了。这里写英文的主要是给不通中文或不了解明朝军事的人看的(主要是外国的战棋众),所以实际上内容稍微浅白。<br /><br />冷兵器研究所我偶尔有去看,里面一些观点相当新颖,不过也有那种“为了一个好故事牺牲一点真实性”的倾向。春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-88644293043614356132018-03-28T12:49:18.434-07:002018-03-28T12:49:18.434-07:00啊太感谢了就是这个= =,之前存过然后莫名其妙找不到了。
原来《抗倭图卷》损坏的比较严重(我甚至想...啊太感谢了就是这个= =,之前存过然后莫名其妙找不到了。<br /><br />原来《抗倭图卷》损坏的比较严重(我甚至想让我在北京的朋友去博物馆帮我拍几幅作为参考...),另外不知您看过东京大学出的那本研究《倭寇图卷》的书籍没有...我查了一番好像市面上研究《倭寇图卷》不错的就是这本书籍了(可惜实在看不懂日语)。<br /><br />另外不知您在中文网络有没相关的博客?相关主题的文章让我联想到大陆这边的一个叫做冷兵器研究所的博客。<br /><br />最后再次感谢!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01816041967627931937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-73485224157474599992018-03-27T18:51:19.623-07:002018-03-27T18:51:19.623-07:00你好,实际上现在《倭寇图卷》是由日本收藏,所以国家博物馆找不到是很正常的。中國收藏的那份叫《抗倭圖卷...你好,实际上现在《倭寇图卷》是由日本收藏,所以国家博物馆找不到是很正常的。中國收藏的那份叫《抗倭圖卷》,損壞得比較嚴重。<br /><br /><br />倭寇圖卷的高清圖在這個網站可以看,但是截圖就很困難了。<br /><br />https://www.hi.u-tokyo.ac.jp/conference-seminar/science/ez01.html<br /><br />春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-60709152442614260842018-03-27T15:02:06.362-07:002018-03-27T15:02:06.362-07:00哇,非常棒的网站!我猜你看得懂汉字(应该是中国人吧!),我现在在为我构思的一个(明朝为背景的军事游戏...哇,非常棒的网站!我猜你看得懂汉字(应该是中国人吧!),我现在在为我构思的一个(明朝为背景的军事游戏)游戏收集资料,但是怎么也找不到高清的倭寇图卷,不知道你手头有没有,在这方面国家博物馆做的实在是太糟糕了...<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01816041967627931937noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-30983044810774055212017-07-13T03:34:19.609-07:002017-07-13T03:34:19.609-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gunsen Historyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03851013673959315671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-10115830362945536802017-07-12T19:16:20.208-07:002017-07-12T19:16:20.208-07:00Good day Luca.
Glad you like my blog post. The fa...Good day Luca.<br /><br />Glad you like my blog post. The fact that Japanese are sensible people and would never want to use weak bows for war just can't be stressed enough.<br /><br />If you have some prior experience with blog/webpage stuffs, I will suggest you to use wordpress platform instead for its greater modularity. Blogger is more newbie-friendly, but more limited in functions and customizability.春秋戰國https://www.blogger.com/profile/14961602507085597255noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1776482547357658591.post-22652966679692489692017-07-12T12:44:51.588-07:002017-07-12T12:44:51.588-07:00Hi, is me (again ahaha).
I wanted to say that I do...Hi, is me (again ahaha).<br />I wanted to say that I do agree 100% of what is written here; especially the part of the Yumi. I don't like doing this kind of stuff, but I've started a blog too ( I have to say I've been inspired by you honestly). Now don't worry, I don't want at all to copy you/ steal something from you, and my blog would deal with Japanese military history. Today I've made my first post, is about the Yumi bow and since I've been quoting some Chinese sources, I've put a direct link to your blog. <br />Who knows, I hope to bring you more viewers, because you deserve them! ( is kinda silly since I've basically started today and I have 0 experience, but anyway, maybe in the future!)<br />LucaAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01467111902804185541noreply@blogger.com